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SALMON NORDIC SKI ASSOCIATION |
1405 Tendoy Avenue |
Phone: 208 756 2085 |
First Edition: January 20,
2005 11:50 - 1st Draft
Major Revision: February 06, 2007 13:30 PM.
Later Minor Edits preceded by *
Web Page Location: http://home.custertel.net/~ckeene41/SNSA_SCFdiscussiontopics.htm
Salmon Cross Country Skiers
Subject: SNSA Discussion Topic for X-C Ski Meeting with Salmon-Challis NF
As a Forest Service Volunteer and a representative of the Salmon Nordic Ski Association (SNSA) I meet periodically with members of the Salmon Challis NF (SCF) to discuss cross country skiing in the SCF. 1/ See below for info. on SNSA.
1. Grooming: In 2004 we had an offer to groom a few of the trails. Most of us prefer that the X-C Ski Trails remain un-groomed. We want the trails to remain open for dogs. Our trails are fairly narrow and beginners can only ski many of the trails when there is an unpacked soft section beside the main track. Grooming may encourage snowmobiles and ATV use. Note that the Ridge Road is primarily a snowmobile trail and that should be groomed for snowmobile use.
2. Snowmobiles are starting to be a minor problem. It’s not a major problem yet, but it seems to be increasing. Previously there were times that the William’s Cr. and North Moccasin Trail were not safe to ski because of the hard pack from snowmobile use. This year trucks and ATVs have used the Meadow Trail and snowmobiles have used the William’s Cr. and Buckhorn Trails. Even expert skiers can have a problem skiing part of the Buckhorn, North Moccasin, and William’s Cr. trails when they have a recent snowmobile track.
3. Travel Planning is now on-going. Currently we have a gentleman’s agreement that the snowmobiles will stay off the cross country ski trails. This has worked well, however not all snowmobilers are members of the Salmon Ridgerunners and there is starting to be more use (See above.). Many of our trails are too short to be of much interest to riders and there are numerous similar roads and trails beyond the area of the ski trails. I’d like to see a formal closure considered for all our trails except as follows: 1. The Ridge Road should continue to be a snowmobile trail. 2. The upper ¼ mile of the Buckhorn Trail should be open so that snowmobilers can continue to access the meadow to the east of the A-Frame. * There was a closed to snowmobiles sign previously where the trail left the road. I’d like to see a sign placed at the point where the Buckhorn trail bears right, allowing snowmobiles to bear left toward the meadow. 3. The fire line portion of the Deep Cr. Ridge Trail could remain open, although it’s not been used much because the thick tree regeneration. 4. The North Moccasin Trail doesn’t get much use and I’d like to see it closed. However, this trail does merit some discussion. Once the Beartrack Mine is closed the road to the mine would make a good snowmobile loop. However, I’m not sure that there is another route to complete the loop to William’s Cr. Summit other than riding up the Moccasin Cr. portion of the William’s Cr. Road and this may be OK considering the light traffic. However, with a little work there might be a route from the Phelan Cr. area through the “Leesburg East” Timber Sale. 5. I’d like to see the first section of the Perreau Cr. Timber Sale Road 5082 (out to the Perreau Meadows Trail) added to the cross country trail system, however this road should remain open to snowmobiles.
4. Added trails: Major additions are probably not needed, but some
extensions, connectors or re-routes could result in more interest and spread
out the use. * For example with the two re-routes that we added to the Buckhorn
Trail, we’ve had an estimated ten fold increase in the use of this trail. In
addition to the existing trail system the original environmental analysis (EA)
also included the Powder House Gulch Trail and the remainder of the Deep Cr.
Ridge Trail (west of the Mukluk Trail). The SNSA recommended that Powder House
Gulch not be added to the system. This is a good route for “locals in the know”
but could be ruined by over use. However, more critically, it would be too easy
for a beginner to start down this trail and get in trouble. It’s too steep to
be classed as a Cross Country Ski Trail (Over 17% sustained grade).
The Deep Cr. Ridge Trail could be extended as planned in the original
EA. The old Deep Cr. Ridge Trail blazes and tread exists in part beyond the
Mukluk Trail. It has heavy Lodgepole blow-downs but is relatively flat for
about a half mile. Beyond this point it goes down a ridge sometimes up to a 30%
grade. This section would be suitable for advanced mountain bikers and
completely unusable for X-C Skiing. My original plan was to put in some
switchbacks and keep the trail on the north side of the ridge where there is
more snow and keep the grade under 15%. I didn’t follow through because there’s
been almost no use on the Mukluk Trail. One reason for the lack of use is that
the trail is not on the ski map. (See # 7 below.) I would be glad to work with
some mountain bikers to clear the existing trail. This does need discussion
however. The area is currently closed to summertime motorized use. Completing
the trail would probably encourage motorized use. If the Deep Cr. Ridge Trail
is cleared west of the Mukluk Trail it’s essential that a sign be added to
prevent skiers from continuing on the bike trail.
It would be nice to have a “true beginner trail”. The Ridge Road is really too steep for beginners and even the Wapiti Loop is a little tough for
some 1st time skiers. A flat trail from William’s Cr. Summit would
probably be best. The previously proposed South Moccasin Timber Sale road would
have accomplished this, but the sale was cancelled. I would be willing to cut a
short trail in this location if there is sufficient interest. I did locate a
possible expert or intermediate trail route between William’s Cr. Summit and
the Wapiti Loop. However, I felt that another trail here might be making it too
confusing.
Skiers often park at the Meadow TH and ski up Buckhorn Trail, down the
William’s Cr. Trail, out on the Upper Aspen Loop where they cross the road and
ski up a fork of the Meadow Trail. They also sometimes reverse the route skiing
down to and out on the Upper Aspen Loop and down the William’s Cr. Trail. I now
have a trail scouted that might be called the Upper Aspen Loop Extension.
It connects the Upper Aspen Loop with the Meadow TH. It follows a creek bottom
so would not be a multi use trail. We need to evaluate this to see if it should
be marked and added to the system.
Snow conditions are often very good between the Lower Shoshoni TH and Mukluk
TH. I’ve found a route between these two trailheads that will add interest to
this seldom used trail area. I have a little more scouting to do. This might be
called the “ShoMuk Trail”. This area has a myriad of old “horse log”
roads that are party grown with trees and may allow a few more loops. I’d
like to see if there could be an alternate route for part of the Upper Shoshoni
telemark trail. The trail has two meadow sections used by telemark skiers. The
bottom section is often lacking in snow. I think I can find another route that
might be useful when snow is scarce.
* During 2005 – 2006 we built two alternate routes for the Buckhorn Trail.
There were two sections that exceeded the recommended 17% grade limit and they ascend
without skins and beginners had a hard time coming back down. These “re-routes”
are generally under 12” grade and are marked with green diamonds (with a yellow
border). The original trail is still marked with blue diamonds and is used by 4
wheelers, bikers and occasionally by skiers. During the fall of 2006, I cleared
a short re-route on the right fork of the Meadow Trail so that beginning skiers
can avoid a short steep stretch. There are some other situations where the existing
trail can be left with blue diamonds and an easier “re-route” added and marked
with green diamonds. We’ve found that green diamonds don’t show up well at all.
Orange is used for snowmobile routes, so I invented a template that allows
one to add a yellow border to the green diamonds, greatly increasing their
visibility.
Some needed or possible trail reroutes include: 1. Where it leaves the Ridge Road, the 1st hundred yard of the William’s Cr. Trail is too steep
and often used by snowmobiles. A re-route is a high priority need. A short
re-route would put the trail across a steep side-slope. We need to scout out
the best location for this needed section. By closing the steep section of this
trail we might also eliminate the conflict with snowmobiles. 2. There are two
sections of the Meadow Trail just above Cougar Point where we now
deviate from the original trail. The recent logging has allowed us to ski a
steeper route often allowing telemark turns. There is still a need for a more
gentle route. Since this section has almost no blue diamonds. I propose
locating the original route with green diamonds and using blue diamonds for the
steeper route. There is one section where the trail crosses the Cougar Point
Picnic area were we need to remove a few rocks. I’ve discussed this with Cavin
Fitzsimmons.
5. Skate Skiing is getting more popular and there
is increasing demand for it. Click here
for a discussion of skate skiing. I'm sometimes asked where’s a good place
to "skate ski"? In addition to the (usually) “Friday Morning
Skating Party” at Chief Joseph Pass, some of the groomed snowmobile trails
are suitable. Usually the skate skiing is best soon after grooming. Dave Lingle has found good skating on the Ridge Road. Other possibilities include Carmen Creek, and possibly the lower Warm Springs Wood Road. When recommending these
snowmobile routes for skiing, I always add that we need to use courtesy and
give the snowmobilers the right of way. I point out that we can’t have it both
ways. We DO prefer that the snowmobiles stay off the ski trails, so we
should use extra courtesy when we use the snowmobile trails. It would
help to know when the grooming is planned and when it’s actually been done. I
used to be on the Salmon Ridgerunners mailing list but haven’t heard from them
recently.
The Snowmobile Trails map (available at Public lands center) shows the grooming
routes that are currently approved”.
6. Maintenance Needs include the following: 1. The sign on the William’s Cr. Trail at the Junction of the Upper Aspen Loop Trail is not placed properly. It needs to be relocated so it’s visible before reaching the trail junction and it may need to be re-worded.. 2. Lower Shoshoni Trailhead sign is missing. As far as I know, a new sign needs to be made. I can provide the previous wording. 3. Lower Aspen Loop Sign was apparently hit by a shotgun and needs to be replaced and the post needs to be re-set. 4. A sign is needed at the jct. of the forks of the North Moccasin Trail (where the trail hits the meadow). I think it may be best to wait until the mine work and snow plowing stop, so we can see where the actual Trailhead will be. 5. More diamonds are needed on the upper ¼ mile of the Mukluk Tr. 6. Several trails didn’t have enough diamonds in the uphill direction. I’ve received several comments about this in the past. Originally I didn’t see why anyone would want to go up the trails, but especially after purchasing climbing skins, I realized that it works well to climb up and then ski back in your own track. It saves a shuttle or boring walk up the road. The Perreau Meadows trail is critical and the William’s Cr. and Lower Meadow Trails are the prime candidates. We may want to have a work day this spring – maybe during “trails day”.
7. Maps: A new map is needed and it needs to be scanned so that an online map is available. The latest map is the 1993-1994 Salmon-Challis Nat. Forests William's Creek Summit Cross-Country Ski Trails Map and Description. This map doesn't show the Deep Creek Ridge (Fire line), the Upper Shoshoni (telemark run), or the Mukluk trails, but does show most of the trails we regularly ski. I have a draft Topographic map that all the trails and is easier to read, but it’s not suitable for scanning.
Please contact Cliff Keene at (208) 756-2085, or Tawna Skinner at: (208) 756-4658 if you need any additional information.
Clifford R. Keene SNSA Trip Coordinator
/s/ Clifford R. Keene
Tawna Skinner President, Salmon Nordic Ski Association
/s/ Tawna Skinner
1/ Who we are: ( See more details at: http://home.custertel.net/~ckeene41/Welcome.htm
)
In the late 1980's and early 1990's the SNSA was instrumental in planning, and
constructing the William's Cr. Cross Country Ski Trails west of Salmon on the
Salmon-Cobalt Ranger District. Some members are Forest Service volunteers,
volunteering time and expertise in maintaining these trails. We also provide
cross country ski information to the community such as that in the following
web site: http://www.salmonbyway.com/salmon/ski.htm.
Currently we maintain a Salmon Area Cross Country Email mailing list including about 85 names. Each winter we publish a weekly snow and ski trail condition report on the web at: http://home.custertel.net/~ckeene41/xcskirpt.htm. We also plan a cross country ski trip almost every week with an average of about nine skiers per trip. We enjoy our un-groomed William's Cr. Trails and the un-groomed trails in the Lost Trail - Chief Joseph Pass area. We also enjoy skiing on groomed trails at the Chief Joseph Cross Country Ski Area.
